Author Topic: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block  (Read 25041 times)

Offline slomofo

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #30 on: May 09, 2009, 10:23:44 PM »
Sounds like a cool little project, good luck with that and be sure to do a write up so the rest of us will know how to build something like it some day.

Offline cf17081

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #31 on: May 10, 2009, 12:06:38 AM »
I dont understand a thing about the stage 3 vtec... damn i have a lot to learn!

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Offline suspendedhatch

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #32 on: May 10, 2009, 03:17:59 PM »
I dont understand a thing about the stage 3 vtec... damn i have a lot to learn!

Well it's SOHC so it acts on the intake cam only.

Stage 1 (0-2500 RPM): VTEC-E 1 valve per cylinder is closed; effectively giving you 12 valves. This has the same effect as squeezing a water hose... it squirts the air into the cylinder.

Stage 2 (2500-5500 RPM): Now the valves open up giving you all 16 valves. Now that the RPMs have picked up a bit, the engine is drawing in more air so you just need to get out of the way and let it in.

Stage 3 (5500-7300 RPM): VTEC Now both intake valves lock onto a higher cam lobe with more duration and overlap to pull more air in within the limited amount of time you have with the engine spinning so fast.

Offline Daviticus

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #33 on: May 10, 2009, 07:07:02 PM »
Thanks for the simple explanation. When I explain stuff like this I get too technical and end up confusing more people than I help.

I do intend to pick up a 3-stage engine to initially swap it as-is into the wagon, and mess around with the 1.7 bottom-end in my current SOHC ZC block. IF everything I've read so far is true, I should be able to bolt everything into the 1.6 block, and only have to worry about the dipstick not fitting [D17s don't have a hole in the oil pump to allow the dipstick through, where the D15/6 do, I guess].

I do also want to experiment with boosting both powerplants. Nothing serious, maybe 10psi out of a Nissan T25 is all. I want to avoid having to custom-grind a cam for the 3-stage head, as the VTEC-E intake profile is almost round, very little lift and duration - that's a good portion of where the economy [the other portion being the swirl effect having one valve open creates] this engine produces comes from.
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Of course the bandwagon is nearing the end of its shelf life. It's gone from foreign, to underground, to baller, to overdone, to being supported by the entry-level aftermarket. That's usually when things are about to die off.

Just waiting for the next trend.

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

Offline cf17081

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #34 on: May 10, 2009, 09:38:49 PM »
Well it's SOHC so it acts on the intake cam only.

Stage 1 (0-2500 RPM): VTEC-E 1 valve per cylinder is closed; effectively giving you 12 valves. This has the same effect as squeezing a water hose... it squirts the air into the cylinder.

Stage 2 (2500-5500 RPM): Now the valves open up giving you all 16 valves. Now that the RPMs have picked up a bit, the engine is drawing in more air so you just need to get out of the way and let it in.

Stage 3 (5500-7300 RPM): VTEC Now both intake valves lock onto a higher cam lobe with more duration and overlap to pull more air in within the limited amount of time you have with the engine spinning so fast.


Thanks... I understand a little bit better, I really need to do some more research about motors in general just as daviticus has been doing.  I am a horrible student lol.

Jk im a somewhat newb thats learning.

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Offline Omido Style

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #35 on: May 13, 2009, 11:07:05 AM »
This is near the lines of what I am building currently, I have a D16Y5 head, going on a built block, on a forced induction app.  What I am hoping for some high TQ numbers, and a wide powerband.

I'm thinking of getting a regrind on the stock cam, it needs to be more aggresive.  IIRC, Bense on Honda-Tech has alot of threads floating around with lots of useful info about the Y5 and D15B head.

Offline Daviticus

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #36 on: May 13, 2009, 12:55:45 PM »
The Y5 head is VTEC-E only, correct? Should be crazy amounts of torque for a 1.6.

Bense is the guy to read up on, agreed.
Quote
Of course the bandwagon is nearing the end of its shelf life. It's gone from foreign, to underground, to baller, to overdone, to being supported by the entry-level aftermarket. That's usually when things are about to die off.

Just waiting for the next trend.

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

Offline Omido Style

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #37 on: May 13, 2009, 01:29:24 PM »
Yeah, not quite the D15B head, but it should produce some interesting numbers.

Offline Daviticus

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #38 on: May 13, 2009, 09:56:10 PM »
I'd be interested to see what your setup puts out, it'll probably be done long before I even source all the parts for this build. I'll have to compare the 12- and 16-valve profiles of the VTEC-E camshaft with the first two stages of the 3-stage cam ... if I can produce something close to your power before activating VTEC, then it should be a pretty nice monster of an engine on the high-cam.
Quote
Of course the bandwagon is nearing the end of its shelf life. It's gone from foreign, to underground, to baller, to overdone, to being supported by the entry-level aftermarket. That's usually when things are about to die off.

Just waiting for the next trend.

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

Offline Omido Style

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #39 on: May 14, 2009, 02:29:12 PM »
are you planning to put this in the wagon??

Offline egab

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #40 on: May 14, 2009, 02:36:56 PM »
This is making me want to find a 3 stage head for my all motor setup. Couple that with the d2b conversion i'm researching and it should be a really fun single cam.

Offline Daviticus

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #41 on: May 14, 2009, 03:37:25 PM »
Yes, this would be going into the wagon. I should probaly be shopping for the '90-'91 RT4WD trans, as it's got the proper sline count for the clutch (unlike '88s odd pattern and '89s proper pattern but small clutch setup) so that I could use just about any off-the-shelf D-series clutch. But that's for another thread ...

If I could use an MFactory gearsetin the RT4WD trans that would be my first matter of modification, but that's the trade-off for having AWD.
Quote
Of course the bandwagon is nearing the end of its shelf life. It's gone from foreign, to underground, to baller, to overdone, to being supported by the entry-level aftermarket. That's usually when things are about to die off.

Just waiting for the next trend.

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

Offline bopApocalypse

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #42 on: May 14, 2009, 08:15:53 PM »
Yes, this would be going into the wagon. I should probaly be shopping for the '90-'91 RT4WD trans, as it's got the proper sline count for the clutch (unlike '88s odd pattern and '89s proper pattern but small clutch setup) so that I could use just about any off-the-shelf D-series clutch. But that's for another thread ...

you should be able to get an 89-91 - with the regular fwd L3 trannies, the difference btw 89 and 90-91 is all in the flywheel - the trans itself doesn't care what clutch/pp you use.

Offline Daviticus

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #43 on: May 15, 2009, 05:26:22 AM »
Thanks Bob. Didn't think anyone would catch that, I was just too lazy to edit my post, haha.
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Of course the bandwagon is nearing the end of its shelf life. It's gone from foreign, to underground, to baller, to overdone, to being supported by the entry-level aftermarket. That's usually when things are about to die off.

Just waiting for the next trend.

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

Offline egab

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Re: Theory Build: D15B 3-Stage VTEC Head w/D17A Block
« Reply #44 on: May 15, 2009, 12:03:41 PM »
Are you going to do a custom regrind on the cam?